What I learned from interviewing nonagenarians

Interviewing nonagenarians has been one of the highlights of my professional life. Two days ago I gave a presentation to the Age Concern New Zealand in-house conference. Its title: “What I learned from writing a play about extremely old people.” I found this a particularly interesting experience for several reasons.

For the first time ever, I didn’t walk to the podium. I danced up to the sound of Nick Shoulders singing “Never too old to dream” —that was very silly and fun.

Never mind the process — that’s another story

From concept to performance, this play was a two-year project so of course I learned heaps. But most of that wasn’t relevant to my audience so I summarised it in a chaotic mindmap that reflected the almost uncontrollable process of writing and producing the play.

What I learned from interviewing nonagenarians

80 percent of the play consists of verbatim material from my interviews with very old people. Most were glad of a chance to talk about their lives and their feelings about being in their 90s (or in one case, being over 100). Let me quote from their own words — and you will get an inkling of how much I learned from these generous people.

They lived in a different world

It seemed like they were from another era of history, even though some were only 8 years older than me.

PUTI: “At school we got the strap for speaking Māori. They called me Patty! Huh. The teachers ‘couldn’t say Puti’. My mother did her best to turn us into full-blown Pākeha. Just to survive, poor woman. […] “I was flat out fighting for women’s rights. I had no cultural identity but at least I knew I was a woman.”

They shared a certain stoicism

They had lived through such different times — born before penicillin was available, surviving the Great Depression — that they shared a certain stoicism. I kept hearing “You deal with it!” This is qualitatively different from our modern attitudes to personal tragedy and illness.

GILBERT: “Some of the stuff that happens in your 90s is bloody awful. But crikey dick, what do you expect at this age? That’s the deal, suck it up.”

“Young people nowadays go public with every pimple. Make a video, tell the world! We don’t. A stiff upper lip was considered a good thing, especially for blokes. It was useful before we had decent health care, and it’s not a bad thing now either.”

TOM: “I made a car out of the bits and pieces I found in the tip.”

Brilliant people left school at 12 or 13

PEGGY:  “I used to work in an office. I did shorthand and typing at first, then I did the books. I could never have been a Plunket nurse. I was dux of the primary school but I went to work at 13. I liked being naughty. Still do. And I am still very competitive.”

PUTI: “I left school at 12 but it didn’t matter in the end. I did typing and shorthand. I never went to university but I taught in universities. For years.”

Many born in the 1930s rose up the socio-economic ladder from poverty

In 2022, most had their own homes despite very humble beginnings.

PEGGY: “Remember that cottage we used to live in in Thorndon? That was terrible. The baby next door had its nose chewed off by rats.”

GILBERT: “My father would say, Son, always do your best. And he said, Polish your shoes. Your clothes may be shabby but you can always polish your shoes.”

They get angry about ageism and they want respect

PEGGY: “When people call me Sweetie I want to give them a good kick on the shins. But if I’m sitting down I can’t reach. And if I’m standing up, my stick gets in the way.”

DORIS (via PUTI, her fan): “In extreme old age, our priorities change. We want as much control over our lives as possible. We want people to work with us, not on us like a car. We want to be seen as credible.”

They look forward as well as back

TOM: “We have so many memories. Sometimes we talk all night.”

PUTI: “You have to be involved, you have to look to the future. If not for yourself, for the planet, for the human race. If not, you might as well turn your face to the wall.”

PEGGY (speaking about their weekly activities in the retirement village): “My favourite is balloon volleyball. It’s a blood sport!”

Joy in life can flourish in your 90s

GILBERT: “Best thing about life in old age? Still waking up in the morning! Slowly, slowly I open my eyes, one at a time. The last twenty years have been pure magic. Here’s my secret. I really love my life.”

ZINNIA: “This being in your 90s, it is different and it’s better. Everything is deeper. I still can’t believe my luck. Every single morning I’m glad to wake up. And surprised. And it’s never too late for love. The very thing you’ve wanted all your life might only come when you’re old enough to appreciate it.”

Learning from nonagenarians and centenarians

We can learn so much from the very old. Even before starting to write the play I felt moved and so grateful to have met these extremely old people. Their voices, their energy, their use of language and their extraordinary experiences all excited me. It was such a privilege to meet them.

You too can interview a very old person.

I bet you have some older people in your life. Interviewing a nonagenarian is something you could do too, to preserve their unique voice and language and stories. Are you interested in this? My next podcast episode involves with Judith Fyfe, who has recorded thousands of interviews with older people for film, books, and the New Zealand’s Oral History Archive. I’m still editing the episode, but I’m nearly done. She has some valuable advice, of course! So don’t start interviewing nonagenarians until you’ve heard Judith talk about the benefits and the hazards that await you. (Including legal issues.)

Matriarchs: A Generation of Women Talk to Judith Fyfe

Disclaimer: characters were composites, not real people

I interviewed thirteen very old people to create the five characters in my play. Then I added words and stories from about 10 other old people (often grandparents of friends). So none of the characters represent any particular old person in the real world. If you believe you can identify a real person in the play, that’s not so! But top marks for trying.